Destruction and its relationship with anger

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    • #8961
      Ciprian Begu

      The fact that in Vedic cosmology the material universe needs to be destroyed before it is created again seems very significant, particularly since the spiritual realm undergoes no such process, as far as I know. Question 1: Is the experience of destruction the key lesson the soul learns in the material world? Is it a necessary condition for the soul to have the revelation of his lost relationship with God?

      Another intriguing fact is the connection between the process of destruction and the emotion of anger, with Lord Shiva being described as destroying the universe through a burning fire, in a mood of anger, with said anger having been held in check for the whole duration of the universe. Also, in general, people when they get angry they have the tendency to destroy objects or to physically hurt other people.

      Question 2: Why is destruction associated with anger and how can we connect the transition from manifest (objects) into unmanifest (ideas) with the emotion of anger, in the sat-chit-ananda paradigm?

       

       

       

    • #8962
      Ashish Dalela

      The fact that in Vedic cosmology the material universe needs to be destroyed before it is created again seems very significant, particularly since the spiritual realm undergoes no such process, as far as I know.

      We need to define carefully what we mean by “destruction”, because material energy is eternal. This eternity pertains to what is possible, so in one sense, nothing is ever destroyed. This possiblity manifests into the “about to manifest” stage due to time or Lord Shiva. The soul then converts the “about to manifest” into “manifest” by its choices. For example, dinosaurs are eternally possible. But sometimes they are converted into “about to manifest”, and the souls then convert them into “manifest”. Similarly, youth and old age go into “about to manifest” before they are manifest. Since the “about to manifest” is being destroyed, you lose the ability to youth when you become old. Basically, the youth becomes unmanifest when the old age is manifest.

      Question 1: Is the experience of destruction the key lesson the soul learns in the material world? Is it a necessary condition for the soul to have the revelation of his lost relationship with God?

      No, its not necessary. One can voluntarily turn toward God; it is not necessary to suffer to love God. Suffering is caused by karma. It has nothing to do with relationship to God. But it is typically seen that when one suffers, he feels helpless. Then he asks the right questions. That typically observed scenario is not necessary. But it is what happens most of the time.

      Another intriguing fact is the connection between the process of destruction and the emotion of anger, with Lord Shiva being described as destroying the universe through a burning fire, in a mood of anger, with said anger having been held in check for the whole duration of the universe. Also, in general, people when they get angry they have the tendency to destroy objects or to physically hurt other people.

      Lord Shiva is the representation of desire, and desire always comes with separation — you cannot desire something unless you are missing it. Destruction also means the separation of the modes, and creation means the combination of the modes. This separation is technically called tamo-guna. Lord Shiva means longing for the Absolute Truth. But that longing is eternal — He cannot meet or find the Absolute Truth. Lord Shiva also creates longing in the material world, as we are separated from what we have, and then we desire it again. But Lord Shiva has no anger. He has longing, but He has patience. He can eternally wait with the longing. A part of Lord Shiva is called Rudra. He too has longing, but the patience in Him is absent. This the meaning of parts: something of the whole is missing in them. When Rudra doesn’t get something, then He becomes angry — because there is no patience. Lord Krsna says in BG, that anger is produced from mateiral desire. That mateiral desire is different from a spiritual longing. The difference is that when spiritual desire is unfulfilled, the desire grows. But when material desire is unfulfilled, it transforms into anger. Therefore, when Brahma asks his sons to create progeny, and they refuse to do so, then Brahma gets angry. Well, he need not have. He could produced more sons and asked them again and again. But he gets frustated. Rudra is that frustration and anger. He is producd from Brahma, when Brahma’s desires are unfulfilled. He is produced as a child who has no patience, and when He doesn’t get what He wants, He cries and throws tantrums. Thus Brahma names this impatient and entitled child as Rudra — or the “crying one”. Lord Shiva is not a child. He is an adult — He has infinite longing, but He also has infinite patience. A part of Lord Shiva is Rudra, and He represents longing without patience. You can think of children.

      Question 2: Why is destruction associated with anger and how can we connect the transition from manifest (objects) into unmanifest (ideas) with the emotion of anger, in the sat-chit-ananda paradigm?

      Like I said above, destruction is separating the modes. Anger is impatience over unfulfilled desire. But it is wrong to say that Rudra is overwhelmed by anger and goes around breaking up things. The breaking is not the effect of anger. Anger is the effect of breaking. It’s like a person who doesn’t like their job of breaking things. But they do their job of breaking anyway, and that makes them unhappy. It doesn’t mean that they are breaking things because they are unhappy. It is rather that they are unhappy because they are breaking. Rudra is a partial manifestation of God. He performs a role, but He is not thrilled about it. So, destruction of things causes anger, but anger is not the cause of destruction. These are very subtle differences.

      Are you thinking that this has something to do with the Christian concept of an angry God who punishes and destroys things if His will is not fulfilled? There is no such God, IMHO.

      • This reply was modified 2 weeks, 1 day ago by Ashish Dalela.
    • #8964
      Ciprian Begu

      I’m grateful for the very thorough answer, thank you. The subtlety of the relationship between anger and destruction was a welcome revelation.

      Are you thinking that this has something to do with the Christian concept of an angry God who punishes and destroys things if His will is not fulfilled? There is no such God, IMHO.

      No, actually, I was thinking of both the account of Lord Shiva (more precisely now Rudra) being born out of Brahma’s anger and how you described the rakshasha associates of the sun-god in Cosmic Theogony as being certain kind of “teachers” through their destructive activities; on this last point, I then thought about the rakshashas that came to trash Daksha’s yajna in Srimad Bhagavatam, in the context of Daksha’s insult to Lord Shiva.

      The Christian concept of an angry God who punishes people for going against His will has always seemed strange to me. But I did take it figuratively to mean that if you break the moral law you will be punished at some point. I just didn’t have the knowledge of how this could be done, and the theory of karma and reincarnation from the Vedas provided this long-sought answer.

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Destruction and its relationship with anger

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